Love it or hate it

(click to enlarge cover)

(André L. Cagni & Marco A. Fonseca, Rock Brigade #47, 1990)

After some time inactive, the band returned to the top with the release of the well succeeded LP "ROTTING", and once again has placed itself in the middle of highly polemic discussions. With the word, Mr. WAGNER ANTICHRIST:

RB - Let's get some things straight before we start. I'd like if you could comment the manifest against religion that you placed on the back cover of the latest EP, "ROTTING".
WAGNER - That manifest is just to explain people our opinion regarding the subject. Because many people say that SARCÓFAGO is satanist, talks about the devil, and we wanted to expose the truth about this.

RB - Don't you think that it's kinda appealing to keep talking about this?
WAGNER - I don't think so, 'cos it's really what we think, religion is alienation. In the same way that television has been an alienating factor. Religion makes people to start believing in God, to conform with the life that they have here, that if they suffer it's because God wants so, and they end up stop believing in themselves, of trying to improve the situation. The message we wanted to spread was for the people to start believing more in themselves and start believing in this type of ideology so that we can make this a better country.

RB - Have you ever had any trouble with evangelists or some kind of christian belief?
WAGNER - Never. At least until now, we haven't.

RB - Well, anyway on the first album you brought a satanist message, and now it sounds more agnostic...
WAGNER - Exactly. We were younger back then, it was a thing of doing it for it's sake, we weren't really enlighted about the subject. Now we're concerned in bringing a message with our lyrics.

RB - You mentioned the subject television/alienation. What do you think about the unilateral tendency of the news that the stations practice, or even the fact that they were a big support for the dictatorship? [webmaster's note: some network companies supported the military dictatorship in Brazil, from '64 to '84]
WAGNER - My feeling is of total repugnance.

RB - But what if you were invited to play on Globo Network [w.n.: a major communication company in Brazil], would you go?
WAGNER - Look, we know very well to tell apart the professional issue from the ideology. We're on this business to win and whatever is good to promote our work will be done.

RB - Was the he very abandon of corpsepaint and the heavier look spontaneous?
WAGNER - It was mainly due to the fact that I started to take over the gyuitars, besides doing vocals, and it was already difficult for me to coordinate well both functions, and besides that to play with all that gear would make things even harder. Back on the I.N.R.I. days the guys were having a hard time with it, it was too complex. We chose to always try to make a visually nice looking show, as long as it doesn't interfere with the music aspect. But the corpsepaint, for instance, won't be used anymore.

RB - You are probably one of the most cultuated Brazilian bands on the foreign scene. What do you think of it?
WAGNER - I don't know if it's that much as you said, but we indeed receive a lot of mail.

RB - Do you already have any more effective contact for recordings or gigs?
WAGNER - Nothing's defined so far, also I don't even like mentioning it 'cause it ain't 100% closed, but we have a proposal to make 6 shows in Japan in August, and Singapore too. We have on our hands a contract from Earache, but we're analysing other proposals to see what's better. Our next album should come out through one of those foreign labels.

RB - How do you feel being probably one of the few Death Metal bands who lasted in the world, when a lot of people has changed to Thrash Metal?
WAGNER - I don't think it's cool if you change your style only because of market problems. That change has been very good for us, 'cos we end up captivating an audience even bigger and more faithful, 'cos we're not the kind of band which plays what others like, we play just what pleases us.

RB - How would you define your sound, Death Metal indeed?
WAGNER - I don't think we're a Death Metal band as you said, neither Black Metal. We avoid the labeling of the sound that we make, we just play whatever we feel like it, what we want.

RB - Could you make a self review of your releases, since the compilation?
WAGNER - I think the compilation was very good for us, we entered the studio with a lot of guts to make it, and it ended up 90% of the way we wanted. Now I.N.R.I. was recorded in a kinda crazy way 'cos we were having a lot of conflicts within the band, we didn't have enough time torecord it neither the appropriate equipment. I like it, the audienced enjoyed it a lot, but I have the conscience that it could have been released better. For instance I'm completely satisfied with the new album, with the whole production, everything was made in a more conscious way.

RB - Talking about conscience, don't you think that the world is more Aids, Pop, Repression than Sex, Drinks and Metal?
WAGNER - It depends a lot of the person's mind. If he's more pessimist, I think it's more Aids, Pop, Repression, but if you are a more optimist person, even knowing that everything's down but you want to rise, the things are more Sex, Drinks and Metal, after all people also want to have fun, c'mon!

RB - Why are you so persecuted and misunderstood?
WAGNER - I think that this happens because we try to be ourselves, we don't try to follow any pattern to please people. We follow our own path and there are people who get what we do, nevertheless there are a lot of people who don't know our work and just bash it for nothing. That's why we wrote that text on the album, it is exactly to try to explain, to promote our message.

RB - Well, I'll show you something in first hand, it's the Rock Brigade readers' poll which will come out on the March issue. (E.N.: this interview was done before issue #46). You were elected on it the fourth best band and also the worst of '89. What do you think of it (I show him some separated votes right now)?
WAGNER - I think that this is it, since bands which have a proposal similar to ours are either loved or hated, it's not the kind of band that you like more or less. Either the guy likes SARCÓFAGO or he hates. I think it's even better that some people don't like us.

RB - What about your cover artwork, which was voted at the same time as the second "Most Ridiculous Feature" and fourth and "Best Cover"?
WAGNER - I think that our cover was voted as "Most Ridiculous Feature" exactly due to the fact that people didn't get the message that we wanted to spread, thinking it was some kind of nonsense act. What we tried to express with it is that death is kissing Christ and he's rotting like a regular person, as anybody. We wanted to give the message that Christ was a regular person, and not as someone sent, a son of God, who will return, etc. He was a regular person, who fought for his ideals and got in trouble.

RB - Well, don't you think that in a certain way you are collaborating even more with radicalism with this kind of music and attitude?
WAGNER - To be sincere, I think that radicalism in not only on the heads of people who like extreme music, but laso on those who listen to a more elaborated sound and think that our music is just plain noise, and they don't pay attention to see where's the musical side on all this. A lot of people who listen to HELLOWEEN, for example, come around and say that our sound is no good, these people should have open minds as well. I'm not and I've never been a radical, I like all kinds of music, if it's well played I like it. (E.N.: this time I comment with him that we usually divide the radicals in two kinds: the left ones who only like extreme, and the right ones who only listen to Hard Rock).

RB - I did that question because of letters that we receive, like this one (E.N.: then I show him the letter of someone who claims to be a former fan of the band, who is not anymore 'cos he got to know that the bassist GERALD was a fan of AC/DC), what do you have to say?
WAGNER - What can I say, this guy is a radical (laughs)! The only thing that I know is that we do what we like, if people think that our music has wimped, it's their problem, we're doing what we want.

RB - You're not that kind of band that plays a lot, you haven't even performed live in São Paulo yet , why that?
WAGNER - We never played in São Paulo 'cos we never had that opportunity, nobody never invited us with good conditions. Now the fact that we don't play much is because I live in Uberlândia, the bassist in BH and the drummer in Araguari, and now we're getting another guitarist... For us to rehearse for this new EP was already a sacrifice. We want to get a guitarist from our area who's really good, so we can make gigs and don't blow it (E.N.: anybody interested?)

RB - Was the song TRACY written for TRACY LORDS?
WAGNER - Ah! Tracy Lords, queen of the porn movies (laughs)! That Tracy from the lyrics is not the same Tracy Lords, it's another. Even though I'm also a big fan of Tracy Lords.

RB - Well, so how is your usual day?
WAGNER - Well, I wake up, brush my teeth, no, first I open my eyes (laughs)! No, now seriously, I just study, I study on the Economics college at Uberlândia Federal University (UFU), I play every day, and rehearse a lot every weekend in Araguari, at Manuel's home, he's our drummer. At night it's Sex, Drinks and Metal (laughs)!

RB - So how would an economist give a solution to our country?
WAGNER - Well, I'm still on the third period, I can't give an opinion about it with too much basis.

RB - Don't blow a cool question, if you were placed on the Economy Ministry today, what would you do?
WAGNER - I would resign (laughs)! The situation of the country is critical, but I think the solution should not come from the government, it must come from the population's awareness. Our people, in fact, needs more education and if I was on the government I'd invest more in this area, as well as in health. Only under this situation would know what's really going on, and would take part more effectively on the decisions taken. Ah! As an economist the first thing I'd do was to somehow disappear with Collor [w.n.: the Brazilian president back then] and replace him with Roberto Freire (laughs). After all, let me promote the party a little, I'm an affiliate... by the way everybody on the band is from PCB [w.n.: Brazilian Comunist Party, lead by Freire], everybody things similar regarding this.

RB - A lot of people still create polemic about your relationship with SEPULTURA, would you like to say something about it?
WAGNER - Nothing to declare about this subject.

RB - Something lighter, then. What kind of music do you listen to nowadays?
WAGNER - A lot of things. From more recent music, like Grindcore, Death Metal, to Blues. On this point we have an open mind, and that's not from recently. Manoel likes some more Crossover music, Brazilian Hardcore band. GERALD likes more CELTIC FROST, PINK FLOYD, NAPALM DEATH... For example, I'm a fan of BATHORY, BLACK SABBATH, AC/DC with BON SCOTT...

RB - A lot of people here in Brazil confuse Underground and confinment, isolation, they thing that a guy can't have a decent equipment, sell a lot of records, have a good production. Then to end this interview, what do you think of this, and what is the Underground for you?
WAGNER - I think that Underground is something which has no cover from the big media, but I don't see anything wrong in a band to ascend, as long as they're faithful to their concepts and coeherent with their music. SLAYER signed with CBS, and I'm still a fan of their even after that, they didn't do like CELTIC for example, who blew it. We are underground, and I think that uour music will always be underground, we'll never have major support from the media.